Following on from Mdjvz’s original posting regarding unanswered questions; here they are collected together yet again. I am using the draft CAR version 5 for any footnote or page references:1. Are followers in the city of Carcassonne deployed when a feature is completed, or when it is being scored?
2. (As a result of questions WHEN (& how) followers from Carcassonne may be moved to a feature, and WHEN wagons may be moved, in the special case when multiple features are scored during one turn).
Is the scoring sequence:
1. Tile-placing player selects one of the completed features to score
2. Take turns around the table moving meeples from City of Carcassonne to that feature (if you wish and rules otherwise allow)
3. Determine majorities, determine fairy bonus, resolve cloister/shrine challenges, calculate scores for that feature and move markers
4. Move any wagon(s) on that feature - resolving multiple wagons by turns as per rules.
5. Player selects the next feature and repeat from step 2
OR is it:
First: Take turns around the table moving meeples from City of Carcassonne to any or all scoring features resulting from the placement of the tile (if you wish and rules otherwise allow). This would occur rather like the way it is described in the rules for the end of the game.
1. Tile-placing player selects feature to score
2. Determine majorities, determine fairy bonus, resolve cloister/shrine challenges, calculate scores for that feature and move markers
3. Select next feature and repeat from step 1
Last: Move any wagon(s) on the features - resolving multiple wagons by turns as per rules.
3. Previous FAQ (Footnote 78): Question: How does follower placement during the final scoring work? Answer: In principle very similarly to the way it works during the game. The 'trigger' for the final scoring is the player who placed the last tile and so ended the game. Beginning with the player on the left of the 'trigger' player, each player redeploys one of his or her followers from Carcassonne to an appropriate feature [meeples in castle can only be deployed to cities, and so on] on the board. Followers can also be redeployed to incomplete roads, cities, cloisters or farms, since these will also be scored at the end of the game. This process continues
until no player can redeploy any more players from Carcassonne. The count still blocks the city quarter in which he is resident. Normally the player with the most followers in Carcassonne will be the one to redeploy the last figure.
The question is regarding the bold underlined part: What does this precisely mean? Sometimes it seems wise to refrain (for the moment) from putting meeples from Carcassonne to a feature and just wait to see what your opponent does and act accordingly. Because of this the end condition is not clear: player(s) might just wait for each other to play endlessly... A more logical way to define the end of the process would probably be:
“This process continues until all players have successively refrained from removing meeples from the city of Carcassonne.”
So if you are playing with 4 persons: the process is finished when 4 people in succession didn't retrieve a meeple from Carcassonne.
4. It is my humble opinion that meeples can only be deployed to incomplete features. The answer from HiG regarding meeple deployment during final scoring is a little confusing.
(Footnote 78) Quote:
“Beginning with the player on the left of the 'trigger' player, each player redeploys one of his or her followers from the city of Carcassonne to an appropriate feature on the board. Followers can also be redeployed to incomplete roads, cities, cloisters or farms, since these will also be scored at the end of the game.”
It can be interpreted that meeples can be deployed to ANY feature, but I think that wasn't the intention. I think the first sentence was supposed to be in reference to the last tile played, not the entire board in general. This is the second time this has come up, and I think we need to get it resolved with HiG
5. Previous FAQ (Footnote 184): "Question: Can a follower be moved from Carcassonne to a farm with a barn—and if so, how many points does a player earn (1 or 3)? Answer: Yes, that is allowed: the farmer will then be scored immediately, and so scores only 1 point per city and is (importantly) not on farm during the final scoring proper". This FAQ leads to some speculation on what was precisely meant: during mid-game deployment? (when a barn is just placed? ) or at the end-game deployment phase?
6. If someone adds a segment to a road or city where he has a Builder, therefore triggering the builder-activated double-turn, can the player place his Abbey tile instead of drawing a second tile?
7. Rules (page 50): "The mayor may be deployed to a city in which there is currently no knight or mayor".
What about deploying a mayor if a wagon is already in the city? There is no mention anywhere that a wagon in a city is considered a knight?
8. When a player connects his farm to a farm containing a barn, is he allowed to play a pig on the connecting tile before the points for the farm are counted? (This way he would receive 2 points instead of 1 point for every completed city within the farm).
9. When a farm scores because it is connected to a barn through the placement of a tile, or because a barn is placed on the farm, it scores immediately according to the rules of
Abbey and Mayor. Does "immediately" REALLY mean immediately (i.e. before the dragon can move around, or any tower capturing takes place.), or does it mean “immediately - in the scoring phase of this turn", so that means just after the tile is placed?
Matt; this has a consequence regarding Footnote 100 of the CAR:
“The RGG edition adds a clarification which contradicts the sequence described in the HiG edition and the FAQ: “If placement of the tile completes a feature, it is scored as normal. Then, the game is briefly interrupted while the Dragon moves.” So, according to the RGG edition of the Big Box, dragon movement occurs after scoring; according to HiG it occurs before scoring.”
This footnote tells us that the HiG rules have the Dragon moving before scoring takes place. Should it be that the farmers are scored before the Dragon moves then it might need rewording to reflect that.10. The rules of P&D state that, “If the player uses the tile to extend a city which is already occupied by one or more knights, the player may remove one knight (big or small) from the city and return it to its owner”. The rules and footnotes repeatedly say Knights. Can the princess seduce Wagons and Mayors deployed in the city?
11. Question: I draw and place a tile with a volcano. The Dragon must immediately be moved to the tile. The rules state that I may not deploy a follower to the tile, but may deploy a Builder or a Pig. Can I place my Barn? The reason this is asked is that on a previous FAQ (Footnote 150) the Barn is regarded as a special figure, although it could also be counted as a follower. So what is the Barn’s status when a volcano tile is laid?
12. A previous FAQ (Footnote 170) asked that if two city walls were touching would the Wagon be permitted to drive from one to another. The answer given is that the wagon has to use roads to move. What about the ‘cloister within the city’ tile from P&D? Can the wagon ‘drive’ to the cloister (assuming the cloister is incomplete) once the city has been completed and scored?*
13. Can a Princess seduce the Monk occupying the ‘cloister within the city’ tile from P&D?
14. Since pigs, builders and barns are not followers, will they be impacted by "Knock out – remove followers" or by "Seduction – follower exchange" from the catapult expansion. The Dragon eats pigs and builders! Would you apply the same logic to the catapult? For "Seduction – follower exchange", can you exchange a pig for a follower? Below are the rules from the Rio Grande website:
"Knock out – remove followers": When a follower is hit (touched) by a hurled token (the follower need not fall down!), the owner of the follower must take it back immediately, placing it in his play areas. If several followers are touched, all must return to their owners. If followers of the hurling player are touched, he must also take them back. If the token knocks one follower into another, the second follower must also be taken back. In this way, a chain reaction, involving several followers, can occur
"Seduction – follower exchange": The goal is to hurl this token so that it comes to rest on one or more landscape tiles on the map of Carcassonne you have been building. If it slides of f the map, it has no effect! If it does not come to rest on the map, the hurling player takes the token back and takes no action. If the token comes to rest on the map, then the players determine which opponent’s follower is closest to the token and may use the measuring board in case of doubt. The player, who hurled the token, may exchange one of his followers with this follower. He may use a follower in his play area or one already on the map. He returns the exchanged follower to its owner.”
15. Does the "Fair symbol" from the catapult expansion split the farms? Two tiles in particular are problematic. One has two different city segments split in the middle by a fair symbol. This one seems obvious that it splits the farms. The other one has two different road segments split by a fair symbol. This one is less obvious since the "yellow sand ground" of the "Fair symbol" does not split the farm, it's the flag on top the tent on the fair symbol that splits the farm.
16. What happens when a knock-out token touches or moves a non-follower? Tower pieces, Count, Princess and Dragon come to mind. Barns and pigs are playable non-followers... are those removed as well?
17. What happens when a seduction token touches or lands nearest to a barns or a pig? Can those be exchanged?
18. How do the knock-out and seduction tokens interact with the followers in the City of Carcassonne?
19. Can the follower being exchanged with the seduction token be different types of followers? (i.e. can I exchange a small follower for my big follower or mayor or wagon?)
20. Can the follower being exchanged with the seduction token be exchanged with a playable non-follower? (i.e. can I exchange a farmer for my pig? Can I exchange a follower on a tower with a tower piece?)
21. Can the follower being exchanged with the seduction token be exchanged with a follower that may not legally be played there? (i.e. can I exchange a farmer for my wagon?)
That completes the list for now. Again, I might well have missed a question or have a question listed that we already have had a response from HiG regarding. It might also have already been answered indirectly by another question. My apologies if I’ve missed anything. Some questions seem obvious, but it would be good to get an official response for. If there are any more, let us know.While compiling this list, I realised that some questions had already been answered within the draft version 5 CAR. These were:
“Question: I draw and place a tile with a volcano. The Dragon must immediately be moved to the tile. The rules state that I may not deploy a follower to the tile, but may deploy a Builder or a Pig. Can I place a Tower piece (a Tower piece is not a follower) as the rules prohibit playing a follower to the volcano tile just placed?
(The reason I ask is that I have been digesting John Sweeny’s Carcassonne – Rules, Questions, FAQs, Clarification and the question came up: Can I place a tower block if I place a volcano tile? The answer given was: No. Placing a tower block is done instead of placing a follower. When you place the volcano tile you get to place the dragon on it and can not move a follower, so you can’t place the tower block either. This seems to fly-in-the-face of the rules, as, if I was asked this question, I would say ‘yes, you can place a tower block as the prohibition is only for followers and even then it is only for followers played to the volcano tile itself’)”
This has been clarified by HiG already. It appears in Footnote 99.
and
“If you have one knight in a besieged city, and another knight in another besieged city, and both besieged cities are adjacent to cloisters, can both knights escape at the end of your turn, or can you only choose to evacuate one per turn?”
This has been answered already. It appears as Footnote 84.Edit: *Just had a look through the forums, and Deatheux made a very good point regarding the 'cloister within the city tile'. Deatheux says that the cloister on this tile is surrounded by grass. Well it certainly looks as if the grass surrounds the cloister, but does it?
Footnote 172 tells us that the Wagon must use roads to move and the rules say that a Wagon cannot be deployed on a farm. Does the Wagon cross the 'farm' to occupy the cloister, or can it occupy because the cloister's steeple is not surrounded by 'farm', or can it not occupy the cloister at all as there are no roads connecting the cloister to the city?
