The Missionary

[meepleater]

The rules are great, and I can't think of any changes, but I did pick up on a spelling mistake;

If the Missionary resides in a city that becomes infested by the Pestilence tile, then upon completion of that city

[CKorfmann]

Thanks, I'm always doing that.  It's a brain cramp I guess!

[edmil]

Re: Fighters and Scholars - should the missionary be able to increase its level.

In fighters and scholars any meeple considered to be a follower can increase its level. This allows players to increase their majority in/on a feature. The increase in level also allowed the follower to fight off the dragon and attacks by the tower.(it doesn't make them immune just gives them another chance)  If you want the missionary to be able to fend of attacks then yes it would level up - there is a cost to leveling up so maybe it would be a good thing.

My thoughts for the Pig and the Builder would be that the follower connected to the pig or the builder is converted as well.  This would mean that the player with the Missionary must have both the builder/pig and a follower available to make the conversion. The reason I would go down this line is because the pig/builder are completely linked to the follower.
This would still be in keeping with the intent of the missionary i.e. to gain control of a feature that was the other players.
It would certainly make it easier.

Just a quick note: I am away with work for the next seven days so I won't be checking back in here until I return. So don't think I'm ignoring any reply to the above.

[JaffaMan11]

Re pigs and builders and the traders and builders bit, Version 0.7 of the rules currently says:

Traders and Builders: Both the pig and the builder may be converted, but only if there are no followers available.  If there is a follower of the same colour as the newly-converted pig or builder (and in this case, the Missionary) on the same feature (city, road, or farm), then either of them may remain.  However, if there are no followers of the same colour (as the Missionary) on the feature containing the newly converted pig or builder, then they must be removed from play immediately as they fail to meet the criteria to remain on the board.   Likewise, if a player's follower is converted, but not the pig or the builder used in connection with that follower, then that pig or builder must immediately be removed unless that feature contains another follower of the same colour that has not been converted.


I agree this still seems a little messy, though I do understand what it is getting at I think.

My thoughts for the Pig and the Builder would be that the follower connected to the pig or the builder is converted as well.  This would mean that the player with the Missionary must have both the builder/pig and a follower available to make the conversion. The reason I would go down this line is because the pig/builder are completely linked to the follower.
This would still be in keeping with the intent of the missionary i.e. to gain control of a feature that was the other players.
It would certainly make it easier.

This makes some sense, but this could make the missionary more powerful then intended. I am thinking maybe it should apply only if the linked follower is the one converted. I think it probably doesn't make sense to convert a pig or a builder (who isn't a real follower after all - no free will, just simply builds - maybe they had robots back then )

How about:
Traders and Builders: If a follower is converted, and this follower is the only follower connected to a pig or a builder of the same colour, than that pig or builder may also be converted if the player with the missionary can supply the required piece, else they are removed from play. If the pig or builder remain connected to a follower of their colour after the first follower has been converted, they may remain. Pigs can not be directly converted.

If you wanted to convert builders, I would offer two thoughts - either
1. a builder can be converted and replaced by a follower (not another builder)
2. a builder under the conversion influence of a missionary can simply be removed

[CKorfmann]

I know at the very least I need to reconsider the wording of the pig & builder paragraph.  It's hard to get it right without illustrations.  I'm not sure how to change the rules without a major change.  My original intent was for the missionary to convert any piece, but then I had to consider the fact that the pig and builder are not considered followers.  (This extends to sheep in the Shepherds expansion I'm working on next.)  I'll have to think about it. 

From the beginning of my work on this, the major constructive criticism was that it was too complicated and/or too powerful.  I've worked hard to keep it from being too powerful and I think converting any two figures (except in the rare instance of an abbey or chathedral) boarders on being too powerful.  I'm also kind of afraid of allowing the Missionary to level up because that might make it too powerful as well.

Keeping it from being too complicated is... well too complicated.  I don't know how to make it simpler at this point.  I think it's OK that it's a little complicated.  Since it's relatively easy to add to the game (it's essentially only one extra figure), and I think it will be fun, hopefully people won't mind taking the time to learn it. 

[CKorfmann]

Sorry I haven't made the latest revisions yet.  I've been on vacation!    I have had a chance for a few play-tests of the Missionary though.  I haven't seen any significant issues it three attempts.  I guess I'm too good a teacher since I lost them all!  :  You can see a picture HERE.

[JaffaMan11]

Hi Chris - Understand what you are saying. I think you can stick with the rules as is, just maybe it is a clean up of the words. How about:

Rules: Traders and Builders: Both the pig and the builder may be converted, but only if there are no followers available. 
Suggestion: Traders and Builders: For each available conversion, if there are no followers available to be converted by the missionary, either a pig or builder may be converted.

Rules: If there is a follower of the same colour as a newly-converted pig or builder (and in this case, the Missionary) on the same feature (city, road, or farm), then either of them may remain.  However, if there are no followers of the same colour (as the Missionary) on the feature containing the newly converted pig or builder, then they must be removed from play immediately as they fail to meet the criteria to remain on the board.

Suggestion: A converted pig or builder may only remain in play if there is a follower of the same colour (i.e. the colour of the missionary) on the same feature (city, road or farm). If there are no followers of their converted colour on the same feature, they must be removed from play immediately as they fail to meet the criteria to remain on the board.

Rules: Likewise, if a player's follower is converted, but not the pig or the builder used in connection with that follower, then that pig or builder must immediately be removed unless that feature contains another follower of the same colour that has not been converted.

Last sentence seems fine to me. Whole thing looks like:

Traders and Builders: For each available conversion, if there are no followers available to be converted by the missionary, either a pig or builder may be converted. A converted pig or builder may only remain in play if there is a follower of the same colour (i.e. the colour of the missionary) on the same feature (city, road or farm). If there are no followers of their converted colour on the same feature, they must be removed from play immediately as they fail to meet the criteria to remain on the board. Likewise, if a player's follower is converted, but not the pig or the builder used in connection with that follower, then that pig or builder must immediately be removed unless that feature contains another follower of the same colour that has not been converted.

What do you think?

[CKorfmann]

That looks pretty good.  I might make just a few changes. 

Sorry I haven't had a chance to fix it yet.  We've been so busy.  I need a vacation after my vacation!    I guess that's a good problem. 

I did get in a couple of really good play tests.  I made one really good Missionary ambush in a hole with the abbey.  It worked really well for me.  I missed another similar opportunity.  The last game I played was a mega-carc game with every expansion and also a few fan-made (no tile) expansions.  It was fun, but interestingly, we played the whole game without a conversion.  The Missionary was frequently the target of towers and cloisters that were difficult to complete.  It was enjoyable anyway.  I hope to have it finished sometime this week.

[CKorfmann]

HERE is the latest (and hopefully final) version of the Missionary.  I made the decision to do away with the conversion of the pig and builder.  I figured it was just easier.  It made more sense to me to only convert followers.  I think ultimately, it would make the most sense if the pig and the builder were followers, but that's a fight for another day.  I've also decided not to allow the Missionary to level up as in Fighters and Scholars.  However, this was just to make it easier for myself and get it finished without coming up with more rules for that.  If you guys want to come up with something for it or play it as a house rule, it won't hurt my feelings a bit.  Hope you enjoy the Missionary!

[JaffaMan11]

Looks good to me Chris - thanks heaps for your work on this one. I agree, removing the conversion of the pigs and builders makes it simpler - the rules for working with the official expansions all look very straight forward.

Hope you recover from your holidays soon.....

[CKorfmann]

Thanks for your encouragement! 

Novelty has requested that I add some illustrations before calling the Missionary complete.  Someone has graciously offered to give it a shot (as I am incompetent with computer graphics) and I have given them a small list of necessary illustrations.  Please feel free to post your suggestions for any particular illustrations you think are needed to make the rules more clear.  Thanks!

[meepleater]

How are these:


Missionary figure with blue disk (purple was the only colour I could make the missionary, I hope it's all right)


I used green meeples instead of black...






I used green instead of black, and grey instead of green...

I hope these are all right...

[CKorfmann]

These are perfect!  At first glance, the yellow is hard to see, but that's OK.  These will do very nicely!  Thanks so much. 

[meepleater]

You're welcome...if you need any more, just ask!

[Novelty]

Yay meepleater.   Merit point for you!  Now all those images have to be incorporated into the rules with the text