Can a follower be moved from Carcassonne to a farm with a barn (and when?)

[mdjvz]

A Farm can score points at 3 occasions:

- When a barn is placed on it.
- When a tile is places which connects it to a barn
- At the end of the game

So it sounds logical that at all these 3 occasions (and ONLY at these 3 occassions!) it would be allowed to move a follower  from Carcassonne to a farm just before scoring takes place.

However according to footnot 76 in the CAR version 5 (beta..) [it is a FAQ actually]

76 Question: Can a follower be moved from Carcassonne to a farm with a barn—and if so, how many points
does a player earn (1 or 3)? Answer: Yes, that is allowed: the farmer will then be scored immediately, and so
scores only 1 point per city and is (importantly) not on farm during the final scoring proper.

I think this is only logical when this would happen during the subsequent course of play, and then only when the farm is connected to a barn, (or when a barn is placed on a farm, but this is mentioned in footnote 77.)

[Deatheux]

yes, Yes & YES!!! for your questions!

the majority takes place before scoring, so the meeples can be switch from CC to a scoring place(even unoccupied)!

[mdjvz]

ha thx, while I was at it something else, strange struck me:

foor note 78:

78 Question: How does follower placement during the final scoring work?
Answer: In principle very similarly to the way it works during the game. The 'trigger' for the final scoring is the
player who placed the last tile and so ended the game. Beginning with the player on the left of the 'trigger' player,
each player redeploys one of his or her followers from Carcassonne to an appropriate feature [meeples in castle
can only be deployed to cities, and so on] on the board. Followers can also be redeployed to incomplete roads,
cities, cloisters or farms, since these will also be scored at the end of the game. This process continues until no
player can redeploy any more players from Carcassonne. The count still blocks the city quarter in which he is
resident. Normally the player with the most followers in Carcassonne will be the one to redeploy the last figure.

I wonder, why ALSO??

I think followers can ONLY be redeployed to incomplete roads, cities and cloisters. (and to all farms, as there is no distinction here between incomplete & complete). If you could, for example, redeploy a follower to complete city it would be counted twice: once during the game, and once at the end. I do not thing that is the idea!!
 

[Scott]

Maybe I am stupid or something, but I don't understand what you are getting at in your first post, and I had to read your second post three times before I could figure out what you were talking about.

I think the deployment before the "also" is in reference to the final tile that is being played. If the last tile completes a feature, it is permissible to deploy followers to that completed feature because it has not been scored yet.

[Deatheux]

But can the "blue" barn (for example) can be "stolen" by red meeples?

[mdjvz]

(Scott) I would never suggest you as being stupid, I guess I was not very clear

I just meant to say at my 1st post, that it was not really mentioned under what conditions a follower might be moved from carcassone to a farm with a barn....

and concerning the 2nd post, yeahh I guess I that is what was probably meant with "also"

And concerning:

But can the "blue" barn (for example) can be "stolen" by red meeples?

I don't think barns can be stolen, they can only be shared (when barns are merged)


 

[crasher]

My interpretation of this is as follows.

You may move a Meeple from Carcassonne to a feature when it is about to be scored. Therefor you could move a Farmer from the Market to a Farm if that farm is about to be scored. In the case of the Barn, this would be whenever another Farm with a meeple was attached (and then scored) or at the end of the game. Either way, if a Barn is present on that farm you'd only score one point per city.

The confusion occurs because farms are traditionally score much differently than other features. You cannot move a meeple from the city unless the feature it would be moved to would be scored. Until Barns came along this only allowed farmers to be moved at the end of the game. Now with the barn you are given another way to get your meeple out of the market!

Similarly any meeple in Carcassonne at the end of the game (assuming he is free of the count) may be placed on incomplete features as they are now being scored.

-crasher

[Deatheux]

But can the "blue" barn (for example) can be "stolen" by red meeples?

I don't think barns can be stolen, they can only be shared (when barns are merged)
 

@mdjvz: ok thx! i don't remember to see this in the rules.

Similarly any meeple in Carcassonne at the end of the game (assuming he is free of the count) may be placed on incomplete features as they are now being scored.

@crasher: then the answer is still yes, Yes, YES!! from the start of the post!?!?

[mdjvz]

I agree with "crasher" with:

You may move a Meeple from Carcassonne to a feature when it is about to be scored.

However I do not agree , with the fact that a follower might be moved from the city of carcassonne to a farm with a barn at the end of the game. Why not? because this farm will never score in normal play, all the farmers are sent away before!

so my summarized (slightly adjusted) vision on this is:

A Farm can score points at 3 occasions:

- When a barn is placed on it.
- When a tile is places which connects it to a barn
- At the end of the game, when there is no barn present!

So it sounds logical that at all these 3 occasions (and ONLY at these 3 occassions!) it would be allowed to move a follower  from Carcassonne to a farm just before scoring takes place. 

[Deatheux]

darn, of COURSE mdjvz at the end of the game i never approch the idea that we can move meeples from CC ro a existing barn to score... this would be the "score twice a city/road/cloister(and now barn) this is not allowed...

but what did you mean with...

A Farm can score points at 3 occasions:

- When a barn is placed on it.
- When a tile is places which connects it to a barn
- At the end of the game, when there is no barn present!()

we cannot deploy the barn at the end of the game?, maybe i misread the point.

[mdjvz]

We can never move meeples from CC to an existing barn to score, because the rules state:

At the end of the game the owner of a barn scores
4 points for every completed city adjacent to the farm

So it is not the majority which scores (as usual) but simply the barn scores!

( I never meant to deploy a barn at the end of the game from CC  , I just meant that when an existing farm gets connected with a barn ór a barn is placed on it, it will score then and there, and no more at the end of the game!)

[Scott]

Ok, now that I understand the question (or at least I think I do), I can offer something of an answer.

The first opportunity to parachute a farmer from Carcassonne is when a barn is placed and the existing farmers are scored. It may also be possible to parachute farmers in the absense of any existing farmers (barn being deployed to empty farm). The second opportunity is when two farms are connected and more existing farmers are being scored. I believe it's the mid-game farmer scoring that allows you to parachute farmers, as opposed to the idea of being able to parachute farmers to a barn whenever you feel like it. Likewise, I don't think you can parachute farmers to a barn at the end of the game.

[mdjvz]

Wel I agree with all situations described by Scott.

(I guess we understand each other, at last)

M.

[Deatheux]

seems OK for me too!

[suomenko]

I am newbie, and had myself lot of interesting questions of connecting the expansions altogether,  but this answer by Scott seems for me very logical, and I do agree with it completely. (sorry for the flood  )