Villages

[CKorfmann]

Several of the Solazy tiles have been discussed, but one set that has been a little quiet and one I particularly enjoy are the Village tiles.  I quite like the work done on these two tiles.  Surely not all population concentrations would have been confined within city walls, so the concept is kind of obvious.  

The mechanic, however, as stated in the rules is one that has already been incorporated, and I think more effectively, with the Wells series of expansions.  I propose that this be roughly a six tile set, perhaps more if it were also to be adapted to Fisherman, Forests, and Mountains.  The mechanic I suggest would be a bonus to farmer scoring.  Instead of 3 points for the farmer, as with cities, the villages would provide only 2 points.  It could be argued whether they should be augmented by things such as pigs and the pig herd tile(s).

I'm also very fond of the Ranch tile and use it in almost every game.  It allows a farmer placed on the tile to have a strength of 2 (as if it were two normal followers or one large one), the large follower placed here would count as 3.  Normal placement rules would apply.

12 tiles would probably work best.  One ranch, five Six 'normal' villages, two each for Fisherman, Forests, and Mountains.

You can find the original tiles on the Geek, HERE.

[loganmann1]

If you have a ranch I'd personally also want to see a barracks and outpost (or even 2 of each).  I think that a tile that ups the value of a follower is the single simplest mechanic for upping the power of a follower there is (and several fan-made expansions have tried to do that somehow) .  I'd say keep that together.  

As for the villages, in our games farms are always so big and influential already I personally don't see a need for another way for them to score more points, though this thematically makes wonderful sense as you said. I like the idea of using villages but I'm not sure that would be my first choice.

[Talisinbear]

Perhaps the village actually is a negative to a farm since those people need fed too

[Talisinbear]

Having only one ranch tile is pretty limited, especially if playing with expansions, just a 2nd thought

[CKorfmann]

If you have a ranch I'd personally also want to see a barracks and outpost (or even 2 of each).  I think that a tile that ups the value of a follower is the single simplest mechanic for upping the power of a follower there is (and several fan-made expansions have tried to do that somehow) .  I'd say keep that together. 

As for the villages, in our games farms are always so big and influential already I personally don't see a need for another way for them to score more points, though this thematically makes wonderful sense as you said. I like the idea of using villages but I'm not sure that would be my first choice.

That sounds reasonable.  I think you're right.  I've modified the subject to remove the Ranch and add it to the others in it's own thread.

[Boondocker]

I might drop the farmer value down to one point per village with the usual adjustments: +1 one for a pig present; two for a barn; no score for farmers attached to a field with a barn. This reduces their impact, because they're much easier points than cities, being contained in one tile with no possibility of being incomplete (and therefore worthless).

Or, playing the devil's advocate here, leave the farms alone, and have villages act like pennants for cloisters and shrines. Lord knows they don't get enough bonuses, plus this would still allow use of a circle-of-stones-as-cathedral mechanic.

[CKorfmann]

I'm inclined to agree with you on the scoring here.  Initially, I was going to suggest a graduated scoring like this, but I too wanted to limit potential.  I like what you suggest, 1 point +.  Also, the can't be affected by Cather/Siege or anything else at this point. 

Admittedly, I mostly like the concept of having villages on the landscape.  I'm open any function that we can agree upon.

[loganmann1]

Just throwing this out there...what if the villages were a cross feature bonus.  Something like...

+1 for farms (plus bonuses of pig and barn)
+3 for a cloister if its in the 9 tile area
+? for the road it is on
+? for a city it connects to by road or is on the same tile or something.

So you have to really think about placement as it will help many things it touches and you want to maximize your bonus without helping your opponents.  What the bonuses are would be totally up for debate, but just the idea of a cross feature bonus seems interesting to me. 

This could also lead to a tlie which  is somehow a villages opposite with negative effects to all it touches.  Or maybe a mix of positive and negavites on villages and/or an "opposing" feature.

Like I said, just throwing it out there while its on my mind.

[Talisinbear]

The multiple scoring options are interesting. I assume only one option can be scored, even it its placement meets several criteria?

Another option is to score a village like a cloister with the 9 squares acting as a barrier to a farm.

[loganmann1]

With the multiple scoring idea i see it affecting all 4 (otherewise farms would never get the bonus).  It would be like a pennent in the way it is simply there for whatever happens, and then the bonus would affect any feature affected by it, but in those ways.  If nobody gets a cloister near to it then it doesn't benefit the cloisters, if the city never finishes then again no bonus, but if 3 cloisters all got in around it they'd all get the bonus.  I see it having an affect on tile placement decisions cause everyone would want to get in on the goodness and you'd want to place it as carefully as possible to maximize your bonuses and nobody elses.

[Boondocker]

I like the multi-bonus idea a lot, and there's precedent for it: siege tiles interact with cities and farms. However, I don't think that the villages need to interact with everything, though. Specifically, I don't think they need to interact with cities. Here's why:

• Cities already have pennants, which serve the same purpose (extra value),
• Affected cities won't necessarily be proximal to the village, unlike farms, cloisters, and roads; this makes the mechanic less intuitive, and less predictable,
• Thematically, villages benefit thieves (more people to rob), monks (more people to preach to), and farmers (more people who need food). Cities, however, are not as easily linked, thematically.

As far as giving bonuses to roads, cloisters, and farms, though: great idea! I'd totally use it.

More questions:

• Should there by any bonus, beyond a purely additive one, to having multiple villages beside one another?
• Conversely, should this be a restriction (not permitted)?
• How many village tiles should there be, and in what forms (e.g., FRFR, FFFF, etc.)?
• Following that, should every village tile have a road (thus having the potential to add to each type of feature) or should they be varied: some with no roads, some with a cloister as an additional feature, some with a village encircled by a road, etc.?
• Should a road which crosses a village tile via a bridge (from BC&B) gain the village bonus?

[Talisinbear]

while thematically I understand it, do farms need more point potential?

I could be argued in those days villagers actually had gardens/chickens etc and fed themselves

[loganmann1]

I'm fine with not doing a city bonus (it was the biggest stretch) but if people do like the multi bonus I would probably make sure that the roads are on every village tile as I like it benefiting roads and cloisters most, but do think it could be 1 point to a farm (increasable by pigs and barns).  If thats the route people think to take it.

[CKorfmann]

Good ideas so far I think.  I'm in agreement that they should not be bonus for, or otherwise really effect cities at all.  It would be interesting to see them have a positive effect on some features and a negative for others.  The only option for a negative effect I can think of though would be for roads, but it could be argued equally the other way I think (does the villiage encourage or discourage thievery).  It will just come down to making a decision.  Bonus to farms seems obvious, 1 point + buffers.  Bonus to cloisters maybe +3 if on one of the surrounding tiles? 

As for tile arrangement, I think 6 is a good number, one could be a four-way roundabout, one a four-way intersection, and the rest different configurations of roads.  It seems like roads would be essential though.  Perhaps the roundabout could be the smaller version around the well rather than the larger one.  It would be themeatically appropriate to include wells too, but perhaps it would be best to only include them on half for sake of balance.  Perhaps one could have a Inn too. 

[Boondocker]

Why do you think there should be more than one bonus-giving feature on one tile? I can't think of any official expansions that do that: Cathedrals don't have pennants, and tiles with trade goods don't either.