CAR - new cover

[Whaleyland]

Matt, where did you get the original images for your cover page? I wanted to try and make a new compilation cover for you, since there have been four official expansions (well, two and two compilations) since the last official CAR release, I thought it may be nice to get an updated cover. Especially since you have gone away from having the blue borders and the cover page still includes it. However, when I began editing the expansion covers, I discovered that your images don't have any of the obstructions on them: no expansion title hangers, no Hans im Glück or Rio Grande Games logo, no cityscape on the bottom and top borders. Nothing.

Where did you get those clean images? Do you have copies of them, preferably in higher resolution than the current cover images? Do you have or know where to find copies of the newer covers, specifically Catapult, Count, King & Cult, and Wheel of Fate? Do you mind if I try to make a new cover page? Thank you!

[Novelty]

I think those are the big box cover images.  The Big Box 2 will have the Count, King & Cult image, but that's about it.  Catapult & WoF would probably be hard to find.  However, having said that, the book might produce a good cover for WoF.

[Whaleyland]

Ah, you're probably right. Now on to find a high quality cover scan of the boxes! I probably will have to edit my own for Catapult, because that will NEVER be included in any Big Box, unless they make a Big Box X: Worst Expansions edition. 

[mjharper]

Pages does work extremely well. It's control of styles is far superior to Word. And I'm only using the '06 version (just never got around to upgrading). You have to be a little careful with the graphics, in so far as they should be start fairly small. I originally used tiffs, and even the compressed PDFs were huge.

Novelty is right, they're basically the Big Box images—the CAR started out as a translation of that only. Then I started tucking more expansions in as I needed them, but in the end that was overwhelming. Too much effort to create. So the current cover is just a screen-shot of the more complicated page in the original CAR, and takes up much less space—which has always been a goal of the 5.0 beta.

I don't theoretically have any problem with a new cover. The current one could potentially look out of date, since I stopped adding the newest expansion. But on the other hand, it does have recognition, and that's no small thing.

I mentioned using the grey version of the wheel in a desktop, and it might be possible to do something similar as a new cover. Also, the new expansion really promotes the 'vines' from the back of the tiles, which adds an interesting new flavour.

[Whaleyland]

So the current cover is just a screen-shot of the more complicated page in the original CAR, and takes up much less space—which has always been a goal of the 5.0 beta.

I understand your concerns and don't intend to increase the dent of your new CAR, which indeed should be smaller to make it more usable (and printable!). The good news is, I have high-res copies of the Catapult and Wheel of Fate expansions, so I can mess with them properly, then shrink them to fit neatly, but in a size-conserving fashion, on the cover with the rest of the expansions.

I do have two requests, though:
1. Assuming you have a copy, could you scan the cover of your Big Box 2 (the German edition) rules and send it to me (or if there is no copy of the cover on the rules like BB1, take a quality picture of the box)? HiG hasn't updated their file for Big Box to include the new version; they still have BB1. I can't find any quality scans without distractions of A&M and CK&C.

2. I was also wondering how you would feel about removing the random boxes for the mini-expansions from the cover of the CAR, since they are now all nicely packaged together in the CK&C, which is, after all, a German-only expansion (except for its inclusion in BB2)?

I am really looking forward to this new release and want to help in whatever way possible. Anything to get away from working on my master's thesis!

[mjharper]

I do have two requests, though:
1. Assuming you have a copy, could you scan the cover of your Big Box 2 (the German edition) rules and send it to me (or if there is no copy of the cover on the rules like BB1, take a quality picture of the box)? HiG hasn't updated their file for Big Box to include the new version; they still have BB1. I can't find any quality scans without distractions of A&M and CK&C.

I don't own either BB1 or BB2. Haven't seen the rules for BB2, actually. The images I used are screen-grabs from the HiG and RGG versions of the rules. (Open in Preview, zoom to required size, use Grab to... grab. Edit in GraphicConvertor).

2. I was also wondering how you would feel about removing the random boxes for the mini-expansions from the cover of the CAR, since they are now all nicely packaged together in the CK&C, which is, after all, a German-only expansion (except for its inclusion in BB2)?

Fine. No problem at all. As I said, I felt the cover was getting out of hand, so let it be. It felt like it represented Carcassonne + a bunch of expansions well enough. But if it can represent better, I'll have no hesitation at all.

I am really looking forward to this new release and want to help in whatever way possible. Anything to get away from working on my master's thesis!

I can understand that . But seriously, thanks for the contribution. I'm looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

Oh, if you're on a Mac and have Pages, I could send you the old CAR file with all the images... Might be easier to see what I did and get hold of them as well (Right click, show package contents.) Let me know if that would help.

[Whaleyland]

Oh, if you're on a Mac and have Pages, I could send you the old CAR file with all the images... Might be easier to see what I did and get hold of them as well (Right click, show package contents.) Let me know if that would help.

Sounds good. I have Pages. I never use it, but it sounds like I may now. I feel rather dumb for not using it earlier for the graphic-intensive Catan CARA. It seems this may make things much easier. Send me what you have and I will try to tease some parts out of it. Thanks!

[Whaleyland]

Okay Matt, I have a draft of my cover proposal done for you. It's a pdf and I placed it in its space from your Pages document. Check it out here. I can make edits in Photoshop if you need them. Otherwise, I can send you a copy of this in jpg. I can definitely compress it for you, so don't worry about the file size right now. Cheers!

[CKorfmann]

What, no CS&C cover art? 

[Whaleyland]

What, no CS&C cover art? 

I didn't include it for two reasons: 1) The expansions included in CS&C are already included in some form in the other expansions; and
2) It has no actual art, rather it is just a box with tile graphics on it, and since it is the only mini-expansion left and is mostly redundant with other expansions, I thought it was not necessary. If others or Matt disagree, I can include it in, but I would do something like I do with the GQ11 and Carcassonne Almanach magazines, having them peak over the edge instead of in the middle. Tell me what you all think.

[Novelty]

I miss the blue background.  The light blue makes everything looks "dirty" somehow.

Also missing is the River I.  I guess you might as well add a row of boxes for RI, R2, Count, King and CS&C.  They don't have to be really big - perhaps you can fit them onto both sides of the Abbey image.

The only other cover that is missing is:


Edit: To be a completist, you should have the HiG Almanac as well

[Whaleyland]

I miss the blue background.  The light blue makes everything looks "dirty" somehow.

Also missing is the River I.  I guess you might as well add a row of boxes for RI, R2, Count, King and CS&C.  They don't have to be really big - perhaps you can fit them onto both sides of the Abbey image.

The only other cover that is missing is:
see above

Edit: To be a completist, you should have the HiG Almanac as well

lol. But are we talking about completism here or are we talking about having a nice, functional cover page to the CAR? I mean, sure I can add all the stand-alone expansions, but let's face it: River II, King, Count, and the various parts of CS&C were all available in some form in CK&C and the Carcassonne Almanach. River I is a slight oversight, but the RGG version of the base game has included that mini-expansion consistently for years and HiG has all but forgotten about it since it originally released. Personally, I place it as part of the base game when thinking of boxes. The Cult tiles included in the HiG Almanach don't even have their own entry in the CAR since they are identical, save the watermarks, to the CK&C edition. Finally, concerning the Kreivi ja Kuningas compilation: it is virtually identical in components to CK&C, minus the Cult, and the artwork doesn't seem to even be done by the same artist that does the other Carcassonne art. I don't really feel it is necessary to include KjK on the cover, its just a compilation and isn't sold by HiG or RGG.

In other words, the only things I really am considering still adding to the cover is CS&C and the River I boxes, just because they have merits of their own. The other boxes are unimpressive and add nothing that isn't already available in an official, full-sized expansion. The reason I decided to keep the blue background was simply because Matt still was using it. I am perfectly fine with replacing it with the Carcassonne blue background, but I want Matt's permission to do so first, since he is concerned that old fans may question the continuity of his CAR if it's cover is too radically changed. Changing the background colour I consider a radical change from the well-known blue-white fade.

[mjharper]

I like it. Considerably less cluttered than the current version. And I think that the blue shade behind the image should remain - continuity, as you say.

Is this is meant to be updated with every new expansion, and would you be prepared to do it? I mean, what would be your intended arrangement for a further expansion?

(Split this into a new thread, btw).

[Whaleyland]

I like it. Considerably less cluttered than the current version. And I think that the blue shade behind the image should remain - continuity, as you say.

Is this is meant to be updated with every new expansion, and would you be prepared to do it? I mean, what would be your intended arrangement for a further expansion?

Yes, it is imminently update-able. I'd be happy to keep updating it, and I could also upload my template somewhere in case, for whatever reason, I become unable to continue work on it.

Concerning future expansions, the size of the images from a new boxes are one concern. Tower and Catapult are both 1 1/2 times the height of the usual expansion box and so take up more space. Basically, if/when they come out with another expansion after Wheel of Fate, I would probably make all the images smaller (I've already done this twice, but then changed my mind about the layout) and place them in rows of 4, instead of the current 3. I'd probably put the first next expansion beside A&B, the one after that beside a reduced Wheel of Fate, and then after that, I'd probably return to three rows and put four expansions in the side columns. But nothing is concrete, because new expansions can come in many forms and mini-expansions that aren't part of compilations may begin to litter corners such as I have done with the two magazines. The simplest fix with a new expansion would just to push things closer together, lose my carefully-measured gaps and re-create a montage as before, albeit one with an underlying order.

The only things I have left to do with it, before I send it off to you, Matt, is add the River I and CS&C boxes to the areas beside A&B. I decided that Novelty had a point there and the area around A&M could use something anyway. I also need to repair the top-right corner of the base game image because I forgot to fill the gap left by the moving of the "rules" caption. The Tower could still use a little vibrance/hue control (I've corrected it like four times now, but it still appears flashier than the other images!). Also, Matt, do you know the color code for the blue background that you use (well, the darkest part of it, at least)? I want to make sure I get the exact right shade of it since I just eye dropped the color from an area near the top of your CAR pdf. Maybe that is why Novelty thinks it is so...dirty...

My remaining unrepairable grievances with the cover are: a) the fact that I can't isolate an image of the Wheel of Fate from that expansion, as the wheel is obscured on both the box and the book and is not the same image as the one from the tile (either side of it); b) the Rio Grande Games and Hans im Glück logos on the Catapult and Wheel of Fate respectively; and, c) the slightly diminished quality of the Catapult cover, mostly in the bottom right corner, from a lack of high-res image captures on Google Images.

[mjharper]

Also, Matt, do you know the color code for the blue background that you use (well, the darkest part of it, at least)? I want to make sure I get the exact right shade of it since I just eye dropped the color from an area near the top of your CAR pdf. Maybe that is why Novelty thinks it is so...dirty...

I don't actually. I have the colour saved, but it isn't a 'websafe' colour or anything. Best way to duplicated it is probably to open the old CAR doc I sent in Pages, open colours, and use the spyglass to identify it...