Lord of the Manor (formerly Castles)

[Scott]

I don't want to allow people to bail out halfway through; this is a commitment. It would also make things more complicated, which is what necessitated scrapping the original rules.

I think 25 points is plenty considering the tiles are being scored twice. I had thought about giving a bonus for pennants in the area, but that feels too random and might be unbalanced between castles in the city vs. castles in the country.

I added the limitation on number of tiles based on number of expansions and some scoring examples (thanks Joff!).

v0.9.1
http://www.mediafire.com/?mnyyitmjgm4

[Joff]

I don't want to allow people to bail out halfway through; this is a commitment. It would also make things more complicated, which is what necessitated scrapping the original rules.

I think 25 points is plenty considering the tiles are being scored twice. I had thought about giving a bonus for pennants in the area, but that feels too random and might be unbalanced between castles in the city vs. castles in the country.

IMO, this is a reason not to bother with the castle. A follower is worth more to me that 25 points for the castle. You need some sort of bonus if you are in for the long haul, and 25 points is not it! All the castle becomes is a massive cloister, and not worth the trouble. I can't see these getting completed very often. I might as well play cloisters... they would be far easier to complete and they score the same (1 point per tile)! I repeat, the scoring is far too low for a long haul feature.

You say that 25 points is plenty considering the tiles are being scored twice. How so? Perhaps, i've misunderstood you here, but aren't they only scored once? If they are scored twice, what exactly do you mean?

I don't think that the 'bail out' rule or scoring I proposed is that complicated at all.

[Scott]

By scoring twice, I mean you can score the tiles with other meeples.

I still don't want to offer a bail out, but I am willing to increase the point value. Would 50 be too much? 2 points per tile is easier to explain.

[Novelty]

How about the Baron receives 2 points per farm tile connected to the castle either at the end of the game (for uncompleted) or when the farm is "completed"?  That won't help you with the ciy castles though...

[Joff]

1 point per tile surrounding the castle with a 10 (or 15) point bonus for the castle itself when completed (34 points (or 39 poiunts)), one point per tile surrounding the castle with a 5 point bonus for the castle itself at game end.

50 points is not really that high considering that it is unlikely that a castle will get completed.

Of course, I prefer my original proposal that allows bailing out!  

Edit: After reading this back, what I meant to imply was that 50 points would not be too high for a completed castle, and not 50 points is not enough Sorry, if there was any confusion!

[Joff]

I have been thinking regarding my ‘bail out’ rule. I like this rule, as it enables you to free a tied up follower (in a feature that is impossible to complete) should you wish. This would be useful sometimes toward game end when you realise that you cannot get any of your followers back as you have been a little over zealous and deployed them all! (Come on, we've all been there )
However, ‘bailing out’ of the castle comes at a price. A  Baron can only ‘bail out’ of his castle once the castle has been surrounded by 8 tiles (like a cloister) but loses any points he might have accumulated. The removal of a Baron takes the place of ‘moving the wood’. So, you may ‘bail out’ of the castle at the cost of all points up to that point and in place of moving the wood for your turn. Just a thought.

[Joff]

“Manorialism was a political, economic and social system in medieval and early modern Europe; originally a form of serfdom but later a looser system in which land was administered via the local manor. The lord of the manor usually styled himself with the title of baron.”

Is that true? Or are you pulling my leg?

Edit: A quick Wikipedia search tells me that it is indeed true!

[Scott]

Sorry I'm not much of a storyteller, so I stick to the facts.

[Scott]

I know you guys won't be entirely happy with this, but here is the final version of the rules:
http://www.mediafire.com/?nmm5hmmirm5

I increased the value of completed castles to 50 points.

Those who want to play with a bail out rule are welcome to do so in the privacy of their own homes. I'm sorry that we couldn't come to a unanimous agreement on including it, but I just wasn't keen on it. If you only want 9 points, save your meeples for the cloisters and cult places.

[Joff]

I increased the value of completed castles to 50 points.

Yes, you did need a greater incentive to finish the castle. This is fine. Had it have stayed at 25 points, it would not have been worth the trouble, but with 50 points at stake... I will fight to complete it

Those who want to play with a bail out rule are welcome to do so in the privacy of their own homes. I'm sorry that we couldn't come to a unanimous agreement on including it, but I just wasn't keen on it. If you only want 9 points, save your meeples for the cloisters and cult places.

I am perfectly happy with this expansion. I quite like the idea of the challenge this presents and the potential reward. I think the 24 tile surround is a much better and logical use for the castle.

The 'bail-out' rule was not really intended for the castle to be played like a cloister, more of being able to get a follower back from an uncompleted feature with a penalty (for when you have deployed all of those followers and wished you had another, the penalty being losing all the castle points that you could have gained at end game, by getting out early). Although I like the 'bail-out' rule, Lord of the Manor is your expansion and I will use as intended in your rules... besides i'm going to pinch my idea and use it myself in an expansion (if it is possible to be able to 'pinch' one's own idea )

Well done, Scott.

[Novelty]

Joff, since I'm out of town at the moment, do you think perhaps you can host that rules document on your site so that I can link directly to it (instead of mediafire) in the Completed Expansions/Variants thread?  Thanks.

[Joff]

Joff, since I'm out of town at the moment, do you think perhaps you can host that rules document on your site so that I can link directly to it (instead of mediafire) in the Completed Expansions/Variants thread?  Thanks.

Scott, would that be ok with you?

[Novelty]

I guess it's only temporary anyways, until Gantry can hosts it here, but yeah, wait for Scott's answer

[Scott]

Yeah I'm good with that.

[Joff]

Lord of the Manor is available from:

www.john-warren.co.uk/carcassonne/files/lordofthemanorv1.0.zip